[roger_smith]

I was thinking about this today while in the shower, because that is where I get my best thinking done. I was pondering the term social engineering, and got to wondering about what EXACTLY is considered social engineering? Most people think of it as getting stuff for free, and as I mentioned in my "Let's Talk Social Engineering" thread it goes beyond simply free stuff.

So, if you look up Social Engineering in the Roger Smith Dictionary of Awesomeness, you'll find:

"Acting in a certain way to try and produce a specific outcome from another person."

The key here is that you're trying to produce a certain outcome from another person. So you're going to take out the trash because you want your girlfriend/boyfriend/mother/father/husband/wife to make you dinner. You know that taking out the trash will make that person happy, and more likely to make you dinner, whether you ask them to or not.

In the end, you're doing certain things with the end goal being a specific response from another person. This doesn't necessarily need to be a malicious outcome.

Anyway, that ends my rambling on this topic. What do you think?

[Oni]

I've always said that social engineering is problem solving, through the manipulation and understanding of human emotions. I also consider social engineering a form of hacking, as problem solving is at its core. By that definition, I wouldn't ever classify warranty fraud or anything of the sort as social engineering.

[JeanValjean]

This is the art of manipulating a person to get a few things

[coax]

I was thinking about this today while in the shower, because that is where I get my best thinking done. I was pondering the term social engineering, and got to wondering about what EXACTLY is considered social engineering? Most people think of it as getting stuff for free, and as I mentioned in my "Let's Talk Social Engineering" thread it goes beyond simply free stuff.

So, if you look up Social Engineering in the Roger Smith Dictionary of Awesomeness, you'll find:

"Acting in a certain way to try and produce a specific outcome from another person."

The key here is that you're trying to produce a certain outcome from another person. So you're going to take out the trash because you want your girlfriend/boyfriend/mother/father/husband/wife to make you dinner. You know that taking out the trash will make that person happy, and more likely to make you dinner, whether you ask them to or not.

In the end, you're doing certain things with the end goal being a specific response from another person. This doesn't necessarily need to be a malicious outcome.

Anyway, that ends my rambling on this topic. What do you think?

First of all, thanks for this. Changed my view about Social Engineering again. Also nice written, good to read.

I thought a long time SE would only be a sort of hacking that u have to learn. (Like the programming and understanding programs/OS/etc at the "real" hacking stuff)
But its definitively more. Its like @Roger Smith said even the smallest things to do in a working relationship like for example a family.
We probably all done something in our family to sometimes get a "advantage" from it. Maybe some ice cream or other stuff u liked
For me SE is now, after reading good books, threads (like this one) and much more, a big component of the normal life. Its not just about getting things for free, its about working together with other human beings, sometimes for a better life together (Maybe its good in both ways - for the SE and the "victim"), sometimes for just getting a advantage.

And also, free stuff is nice too
My personal experience is that u can do a lot with SE'ing and everyone who didnt checked this out should definitively go for it.

Maybe everyone got other views and thoughts about this. That's mine.

[roger_smith]

First of all, thanks for this. Changed my view about Social Engineering again. Also nice written, good to read.

I thought a long time SE would only be a sort of hacking that u have to learn. (Like the programming and understanding programs/OS/etc at the "real" hacking stuff)
But its definitively more. Its like @Roger Smith said even the smallest things to do in a working relationship like for example a family.
We probably all done something in our family to sometimes get a "advantage" from it. Maybe some ice cream or other stuff u liked
For me SE is now, after reading good books, threads (like this one) and much more, a big component of the normal life. Its not just about getting things for free, its about working together with other human beings, sometimes for a better life together (Maybe its good in both ways - for the SE and the "victim"), sometimes for just getting a advantage.

And also, free stuff is nice too
My personal experience is that u can do a lot with SE'ing and everyone who didnt checked this out should definitively go for it.

Maybe everyone got other views and thoughts about this. That's mine.

Sounds to me you're definitely on the right track/mindset RE social engineering.

One thing to remember is that an SE skillset- just like any other skillset- can be used for good or bad. It's another tool, just like a piece of software, a firearm, or a hammer. How you use it determines whether it's "good" or "bad."

[coax]

Sounds to me you're definitely on the right track/mindset RE social engineering.

One thing to remember is that an SE skillset- just like any other skillset- can be used for good or bad. It's another tool, just like a piece of software, a firearm, or a hammer. How you use it determines whether it's "good" or "bad."

The Truth in this post is stronk.
There is nothing more to add I guess.

Other guys got a other opinion? Im agog.

/coax

[Master]

Social Engineering (SE) is a blend of science, psychology and art. While it is amazing
and complex, it is also very simple.

It is best defines as, “Any act that influences a person to take an action that may or may not be in their best interest.” It has been defined in very broad and general terms because I feel that social engineering is not always negative, but encompasses how we communicate with our parents, therapists, children, spouses and others.

[Extract from The Art of Human Hacking]
Social engineering (SE) has been largely misunderstood, leading to many differing opinions on what social engineering is and how it works. This has led to a situation where some may view SE as simply lying to scam trivial free items such as pizza or obtaining sexual gratification; others think SE just refers to the tools used by criminals or con men, or perhaps that it is a science whose theories can be broken down into parts or equations and studied. Or perhaps it’s a long-lost mystical art giving practitioners the ability to use powerful mind tricks like a magician or illusionist.

In whatever camp your flag flies, this book is for you. Social engineering is used every day by everyday people in everyday situations. A child trying to get her way in the candy aisle or an employee looking for a raise is using social engineering. Social engineering happens in government or small business marketing. Unfortunately, it is also present when criminals, con men, and the like trick people into giving away information that makes them vulnerable to crimes. Like any tool, social engineering is not good or evil, but simply a tool that has many different uses.

[Cressi]

First of all; fantastic train of thought ^^

I would agree with you on this; mostly, anyways. The way I look at it social engineering is that it's a skill set helping you to get your way here in life. It goes further than that, though. Social engineering is, to me, the whole idea of seeing, taking in and understanding the thoughts of those around you. When creating a rapport, for example, the ground idea isn't to make someone else like you more. It's about getting in their head; and if I act like you, I'm more likely to see your point of view on things.
So yeah, social engineering can indeed be about formally requesting free stuff and betraying the trust of customer service employees. But in reality, I'm just trying to get to know you.

I also consider social engineering a form of hacking

Yay!

[roger_smith]

I like the discussion I'm seeing in this thread, keep it up. Full disclosure, I haven't read much on Social Engineering, it's something that just comes pretty natural to me. I think it's interesting that a lot of the "official" definitions seem to align with what I wrote in the OP.

[lux]

Social engineering (to me) is manipulating a situation to your own benefit.
Technically, asking politely is social engineering.